Comments on: Woman fed to dogs: Taslim Solangi and an end to civility http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/ where the world thinks out loud Sun, 14 Mar 2010 23:39:16 +0000 hourly 1 By: FIA » some recent things of interest/citeva stiri recente http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/comment-page-1/#comment-2139 FIA » some recent things of interest/citeva stiri recente Sat, 22 Nov 2008 19:42:25 +0000 http://globalcomment.com/?p=569#comment-2139 [...] Woman Fed To Dogs: Taslim Solangi and an End to Civility [...] [...] Woman Fed To Dogs: Taslim Solangi and an End to Civility [...]

]]> By: Friday Links — November 21, 2008 « Muslimah Media Watch http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/comment-page-1/#comment-2121 Friday Links — November 21, 2008 « Muslimah Media Watch Fri, 21 Nov 2008 08:01:05 +0000 http://globalcomment.com/?p=569#comment-2121 [...] writes about Taslim Solangi’s horrific murder. More from [...] [...] writes about Taslim Solangi’s horrific murder. More from [...]

]]> By: Scherezade http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/comment-page-1/#comment-2054 Scherezade Mon, 17 Nov 2008 08:20:59 +0000 http://globalcomment.com/?p=569#comment-2054 No. I wouldn't want to change the headline. I stand by it. :) No. I wouldn’t want to change the headline. I stand by it.
:)

]]> By: Harry Stottle http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/comment-page-1/#comment-2043 Harry Stottle Sat, 15 Nov 2008 14:39:36 +0000 http://globalcomment.com/?p=569#comment-2043 Unlike one of my stumbling friends who refuses to accept that these murdering thugs are members of our species, whether we care to admit it or not, these animals ARE "fellow" human beings; which raises the question of whether, given that fact, we are responsible for intervening to prevent such outrages against other members of our species and, if so, how. The author's natural desire for revenge in the "eye for an eye" mode is the fuel which has fed thousands of years of bloodlust driven vendettas. I also disagree with the author in one other vital respect: her focus on this being an issue for brown women. The justification which men (almost exclusively) in authority feel entitles them to behave this brutally to other men, women and children throughout the world is the factor which should unite us. They are the enemy. We should feel equally outraged by the bullies kicking in the doors of an 88 Year old woman in the Police State of America http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kathryn_Johnston or the ethnic cleansing being carried out in Sudan by the Janajaweed vermin http://www.janjaweed.com/ or Samir Kuntar's smashing a little girl's skull with his rifle butt http://www.anorak.co.uk/twitterings/185856.html or the Israeli soldiers who shoot children in the back http://www.revisionisthistory.org/palestine46.html. And on and on... All of these actions are carried out by humans against other humans. None are remotely excusable. What are we going to do about it? My own answer is that we cannot and should not attempt to beat them at their own game. As Ghandi said, "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind". What we need to do is make it impossible for them to act without being seen. There is always sufficient public momentum to counter the criminals once their actions are exposed, unequivocally, to the public gaze. This applies whether the relevant criminal is the managing director of Enron, a Burmese policeman or a wife-beating politician. This is why the criminals tend to hide what they do and to deny that they did it. The major exception is terrorism - where public visibility is "useful" to amplify the terror. The bullies who control the world are frantically covering the planet with surveillance systems designed to make it even easier for them to control us. In every case they are keen to learn more and more about what we are doing and equally keen to hide what they get up to. I say it's time we turned that logic and the technology against them. Unlike one of my stumbling friends who refuses to accept that these murdering thugs are members of our species, whether we care to admit it or not, these animals ARE “fellow” human beings; which raises the question of whether, given that fact, we are responsible for intervening to prevent such outrages against other members of our species and, if so, how.

The author’s natural desire for revenge in the “eye for an eye” mode is the fuel which has fed thousands of years of bloodlust driven vendettas. I also disagree with the author in one other vital respect: her focus on this being an issue for brown women.

The justification which men (almost exclusively) in authority feel entitles them to behave this brutally to other men, women and children throughout the world is the factor which should unite us. They are the enemy.

We should feel equally outraged by the bullies kicking in the doors of an 88 Year old woman in the Police State of America http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kathryn_Johnston or the ethnic cleansing being carried out in Sudan by the Janajaweed vermin http://www.janjaweed.com/ or Samir Kuntar’s smashing a little girl’s skull with his rifle butt http://www.anorak.co.uk/twitterings/185856.html or the Israeli soldiers who shoot children in the back http://www.revisionisthistory.org/palestine46.html. And on and on…

All of these actions are carried out by humans against other humans. None are remotely excusable. What are we going to do about it? My own answer is that we cannot and should not attempt to beat them at their own game. As Ghandi said, “An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind”. What we need to do is make it impossible for them to act without being seen. There is always sufficient public momentum to counter the criminals once their actions are exposed, unequivocally, to the public gaze.

This applies whether the relevant criminal is the managing director of Enron, a Burmese policeman or a wife-beating politician. This is why the criminals tend to hide what they do and to deny that they did it. The major exception is terrorism – where public visibility is “useful” to amplify the terror.

The bullies who control the world are frantically covering the planet with surveillance systems designed to make it even easier for them to control us. In every case they are keen to learn more and more about what we are doing and equally keen to hide what they get up to. I say it’s time we turned that logic and the technology against them.

]]> By: Natalia Antonova http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/comment-page-1/#comment-2013 Natalia Antonova Wed, 12 Nov 2008 16:21:35 +0000 http://globalcomment.com/?p=569#comment-2013 In the initial reports I read, it was said that it was hoped that the dogs would tear her to pieces, and when that wasn't enough, she was shot. The word "fed" is very subjective here, but it's interpretive, not an exaggeration. I knew of a ghastly case in Soviet Russia when a baby was thrown to pigs, for example - it wasn't technically "fed" to anyone, but it was bitten and trampled to death like a piece of prey - hence the word "fed" was used to describe what happened. I wouldn't have a problem with amending the headline if that's what Sanchita wants. But I do not see Blackpaw's comments here, or elsewhere, are reasonable. First it was "racist lie." Then it became "you're twisting facts so you can get off on it." With an extra dash of "I don't like reporters" thrown in. I don't consider that reasonable discourse in the least. In the initial reports I read, it was said that it was hoped that the dogs would tear her to pieces, and when that wasn’t enough, she was shot. The word “fed” is very subjective here, but it’s interpretive, not an exaggeration. I knew of a ghastly case in Soviet Russia when a baby was thrown to pigs, for example – it wasn’t technically “fed” to anyone, but it was bitten and trampled to death like a piece of prey – hence the word “fed” was used to describe what happened.

I wouldn’t have a problem with amending the headline if that’s what Sanchita wants.

But I do not see Blackpaw’s comments here, or elsewhere, are reasonable.

First it was “racist lie.” Then it became “you’re twisting facts so you can get off on it.” With an extra dash of “I don’t like reporters” thrown in.

I don’t consider that reasonable discourse in the least.

]]> By: Viqar Qadir http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/comment-page-1/#comment-2011 Viqar Qadir Wed, 12 Nov 2008 16:11:21 +0000 http://globalcomment.com/?p=569#comment-2011 I will side with Blackpaw who seems to be the only voice of reason here. Its one of the incidents that produces a strong emotional reaction. And a strong emotional reaction in us "desi log" has peculiar manifestations. Fact becomes kind of mixed up with fiction. Anger takes over and feeds the fiction which feeds the anger and so on and so forth. Although its a well known fact that desi log are amongst the most racist anywhere. I think thats not the word Blackpaw intended to use. He/she was refering, perhaps to the validity of an appraisal of a barbaric (and barbaric it is) act in Pakistan thats profered by an Indian author. I would question it myself. And what is more, I would note that exaggeration does not make for a stronger case, it actually weakens it. Once I am not sure about the facts presented here, I am not sure how far to go with my faith in the writer's impartiality. I did some research and came up with the fact for example that she wasnt "fed" to the dogs. She was mauled by stray dogs and she was shot to death. I am not sure what led to what but I am sure it was a brutal honour killing. Now what we need is to think clearly and present clear information so that clear actions may result. Raves and rants are easy to dismiss because their exaggerated nature offer built in excuses for dismissal. I will side with Blackpaw who seems to be the only voice of reason here.
Its one of the incidents that produces a strong emotional reaction. And a strong emotional reaction in us “desi log” has peculiar manifestations. Fact becomes kind of mixed up with fiction. Anger takes over and feeds the fiction which feeds the anger and so on and so forth.
Although its a well known fact that desi log are amongst the most racist anywhere. I think thats not the word Blackpaw intended to use. He/she was refering, perhaps to the validity of an appraisal of a barbaric (and barbaric it is) act in Pakistan thats profered by an Indian author. I would question it myself. And what is more, I would note that exaggeration does not make for a stronger case, it actually weakens it. Once I am not sure about the facts presented here, I am not sure how far to go with my faith in the writer’s impartiality. I did some research and came up with the fact for example that she wasnt “fed” to the dogs. She was mauled by stray dogs and she was shot to death. I am not sure what led to what but I am sure it was a brutal honour killing. Now what we need is to think clearly and present clear information so that clear actions may result. Raves and rants are easy to dismiss because their exaggerated nature offer built in excuses for dismissal.

]]> By: Scherezade http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/comment-page-1/#comment-2010 Scherezade Wed, 12 Nov 2008 15:42:40 +0000 http://globalcomment.com/?p=569#comment-2010 possession* possession*

]]> By: Scherezade http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/comment-page-1/#comment-2009 Scherezade Wed, 12 Nov 2008 15:41:39 +0000 http://globalcomment.com/?p=569#comment-2009 @ Blackpaw - Also, I wanted to let you know that not every Indian is gunning for a Pakistani's neck just because of our chequered past. This is assumption is really funny since you obviously assume that all of us Indians and Pakistanis are really ignorant Angry Brown People who are not in position of even an iota of emotional intelligence to differentiate between our past and our present. Or capable of commiserating over issues like these since we are sworn enemies or sommin! Smacks of racism. It does. Yes ideological differences between people exist. Cultural, too. But, on some level, yes, we are ALL brown folk. Drama Obsessed Third world urchins perhaps? Hah! Listen, armchair critics are passe. Really. What room exists of "drama" here? I am sorry that you are unable to wrap your brain around the fact that indeed it's the unhinged brutality of this incident that renders the so called "dramatic effect". As bad as that sounds. Go find yourself a few books by Tehemina Durrani, some of those clouds over your head will clear. @ Blackpaw – Also, I wanted to let you know that not every Indian is gunning for a Pakistani’s neck just because of our chequered past. This is assumption is really funny since you obviously assume that all of us Indians and Pakistanis are really ignorant Angry Brown People who are not in position of even an iota of emotional intelligence to differentiate between our past and our present. Or capable of commiserating over issues like these since we are sworn enemies or sommin!
Smacks of racism. It does.
Yes ideological differences between people exist. Cultural, too. But, on some level, yes, we are ALL brown folk. Drama Obsessed Third world urchins perhaps? Hah!
Listen, armchair critics are passe. Really.
What room exists of “drama” here?
I am sorry that you are unable to wrap your brain around the fact that indeed it’s the unhinged brutality of this incident that renders the so called “dramatic effect”. As bad as that sounds.
Go find yourself a few books by Tehemina Durrani, some of those clouds over your head will clear.

]]> By: Captain Janeway http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/comment-page-1/#comment-2003 Captain Janeway Wed, 12 Nov 2008 08:18:18 +0000 http://globalcomment.com/?p=569#comment-2003 "apologize for what?" Apologize for accusing the author of racism and then pretending that your real beef is with me. "Though are you seriously saying that brown people can’t be racist to other brown people? are you unaware of the past and current history between India and Pakistan? or do you just think they’re just all “brown” people." No, you idiot, which is why I pointed out that Ms. Sanchita was writing about a neighboring society and had spoken about her own ignorance on certain matters. She has the humility that you obviously lack. "The details of the story bothered me - stray dogs will not chase and eat humans, and later reports are denying that now. When I posted there was only one (english) online only paper reporting it that looked like a tabloid with sensationalised details. It seemed tailor made to appeal to western prejudices." That's not true. When this story first went up here I searched for details of Taslim Solangi online, and I got different reports on this situation. I guess you obviously don't realize that people have been watching this on their local news as well? And that details between those reports and reports you may have seen may vary for many reasons? For a person who's desperate to stick the racist label on anyone you get within your sights, you only seem to trust the AP which is an American organization (yes, I read Renegade Evolution's blog but can't respond there because Blogger is giving me the finger). Go impress someone else with your credentials. “apologize for what?”

Apologize for accusing the author of racism and then pretending that your real beef is with me.

“Though are you seriously saying that brown people can’t be racist to other brown people? are you unaware of the past and current history between India and Pakistan? or do you just think they’re just all “brown” people.”

No, you idiot, which is why I pointed out that Ms. Sanchita was writing about a neighboring society and had spoken about her own ignorance on certain matters.

She has the humility that you obviously lack.

“The details of the story bothered me – stray dogs will not chase and eat humans, and later reports are denying that now. When I posted there was only one (english) online only paper reporting it that looked like a tabloid with sensationalised details. It seemed tailor made to appeal to western prejudices.”

That’s not true. When this story first went up here I searched for details of Taslim Solangi online, and I got different reports on this situation.

I guess you obviously don’t realize that people have been watching this on their local news as well? And that details between those reports and reports you may have seen may vary for many reasons?

For a person who’s desperate to stick the racist label on anyone you get within your sights, you only seem to trust the AP which is an American organization (yes, I read Renegade Evolution’s blog but can’t respond there because Blogger is giving me the finger).

Go impress someone else with your credentials.

]]> By: The end of civility debate « Try Not. Do or Do Not. http://globalcomment.com/2008/woman-fed-to-dogs-taslim-solangi-and-an-end-to-civility/comment-page-1/#comment-2002 The end of civility debate « Try Not. Do or Do Not. Wed, 12 Nov 2008 07:43:17 +0000 http://globalcomment.com/?p=569#comment-2002 [...] November 12, 2008 at 7:43 am · Filed under Linking Park, The Observationist ·Tagged crimes, Feminism, global comment The Taslim Solangi essay is up at Global Comment. [...] [...] November 12, 2008 at 7:43 am · Filed under Linking Park, The Observationist ·Tagged crimes, Feminism, global comment The Taslim Solangi essay is up at Global Comment. [...]

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